The Land Rover Series 2 Club Forum

Advanced search  

News:

   September - start looking for your conkers & sloe berries ...

Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5   Go Down

Author Topic: Club Demographics  (Read 1309 times)

Tom

  • Moderator
  • Master of the oils
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Evesham, Worcestershire
  • Posts: 633
  • Member no : 3375
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #45 on: September 15, 2021, 01:04:13 PM »

The membership system can’t record when you joined but the Forum records when you first registered. I agree that’s not the same thing but it is at least an indication.

Date Registered: February 09, 2020, 10:41:48 PM

Only downside of that is that the club moved to a new forum on 3rd August 2019. If you take a look at the members list, and click the heading of date registered, it will arrange them in order. But you’ll see that no one joined prior to 3/8/19, and on that day lots and lots of people joined.

I myself joined the previous version of the forum sometime in 2011 but only show as having joined along with many others, in 2019  :cheers
Logged

Genem

  • Moderator
  • Master of the oils
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Perthshire
  • Posts: 2293
  • Member no : 4186
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #46 on: September 15, 2021, 01:21:38 PM »

The membership system can’t record when you joined but the Forum records when you first registered. I agree that’s not the same thing but it is at least an indication.

Date Registered: February 09, 2020, 10:41:48 PM

To be pedantic, the current system records when people paid and how ( but no other financial detail) so for new members since late 2019 we do know when you joined and renewed. What we do not have is any detail ( other than what is in back-numbers of B2L) about when previous members joined. We longer term members only show up in the "history" as part of the mass data transfer (an excel spreadsheet) extracted from the old system in 2019. Current membership numbers have just started using 76xx numbers, I'll tot up how many we have in each 500 number "batch".  Anyone fancy trawling the B2L back-numbers on the website to put a date on each batch ? 1-500, 501-1000 etc ?   ( Pretend we are all chassis numbers.... :-) )

 

Logged
I'm not totally daft, some bits are missing

Wittsend

  • Administrator
  • Master of the oils
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Norwich
  • Posts: I am a geek!!
  • Member no : 980
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #47 on: September 15, 2021, 01:51:24 PM »

Will members of over 40 years membership be tax subs exempt ???

Hat ...
Coat ...  :tiphat
Logged
Who's a
 

A-Ro

  • S2C Member
  • Master of the oils
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Oxford
  • Posts: 511
  • Member no : 1998
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #48 on: September 15, 2021, 02:54:34 PM »

Plus I read my date wrong because I joined the forum years before 2020. Sometimes I just shouldn’t be allowed near a keyboard.
Logged
When designing something to be foolproof never underestimate the ingenuity of fools.

Correus

  • S2C Member
  • Master of the oils
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Belle Plaine, Kansas
  • Posts: 1043
  • Member no : 6508
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #49 on: September 15, 2021, 04:46:41 PM »

I am now in my mid 70's and admit I can get mildly irritated if someone asks a simple question on the forum where I know the answer is available in previous threads or in the vehicle handbook e.g. "what is the ignition timing", why didn’t they just look it up?  BUT I then have to remind myself that it is now a different world to when I first had a Land Rover, about 1966. There was no internet & we as a family didn't even have a phone in the house. Virtually all contact with my work colleagues, mates or fellow Land Rover owners in the local club, was face to face, and I am sure at the time I was asking similar sorts of questions, but they weren't in the public domain.  Also,  modern cars do not work the same way and there is no real culture of “tinkering” with them , when youngsters are growing up, so this basic knowledge will easily be lost if we are not welcoming to new younger members  .  In the digital world we must respect that asking questions on  this forum is the same as I did back in the 1960’s, face to face and freely offer advice and encourage the questions without putdown.

I completely understand, and get, all that you have said here.

I was, and still am at times, one of those annoying people who ask basic questions that frustrate some people.  Let me explain though.

I grew up around vehicles and machinery, my parents owned a trenching company - underground cables and such.  My brother took to mechanics like a duck takes to water... me - not so much.  I wanted to work on the engines and such, but I just seemed to make matters worse.  When the mechanics, who worked for my father, saw me coming they'd put away their tools and shoo me off.  Even the high school shop teacher knew my reputation.  So, when it comes to vehicles all I knew how to do was add gas, add oil and do an oil change, change a tire, and once in a blue moon I might change a belt or sparkplugs. One time, while a teenager, I did replace a starter and a U-joint (it was on a big truck, didn't have to remove the drive haft, part of the yolk was removed and it slid in and out easily).

All that being said - I'm the least likely person to buy a vintage vehicle; especially one that is so unusual in our area the closest mechanic with any experience with them was several hours away.

I bought Grover as a 'proof of life' project.  I had loved the old Land Rovers ever since I was a kid and saw them on the original 'Mutual of Omaha's Wild Kingdom', yet I had never seen one in person.

All of my family members and friends thought I was insane for wanting one; and SWMBO insisted that if I got one I had do the work on it.  Everyone figured I'd drop the idea - obviously I didn't.

Now here's the point of the story... I purchased the shop manual, as well as the parts book, optional equipment book, the Haynes manual, a LR restoration book, as well as a 250 piece basic mechanics tool set, shop jack and jack stands.  Did all of this the day I bought Grover.  The books arrived before he did.

Even with all of this available to me - I still lacked two major things; knowledge and experience.  I had no idea what things were called, still don't know what to call some things.  And since I had no experience with Rovers I had no idea if that leak was normal, or if that sound was normal and etc.  I've owned Grover for almost 20 years and I'm still learning, yet now I'm a little wiser and a bit more knowledgeable, but I'm FAR from knowing it all - and still need help. 

The biggest majority of all y'all have years of hands-on experience with these, and I suspect some of you are trained mechanics.  Try to remember a time before that and look at the shop manuals, parts books and such - it's like a new language AND mathematics textbooks combined!  These can be intimidating to someone with no mechanical skills or knowledge.

If you don't know what something is, or you don't know what it's called, or you don't know what it's supposed to do you probably won't be able to look it up in any of the books for lack of knowing where to look.  Even if you might have a general idea where to look in the books, or on the internet, you may still need to reach out and ask.  The question may seem simple and mundane to those who have vast experience and knowledge, and thus annoying, but consider this... if I'm asking one of those types of questions it's because I'm at the end of my knowledge and understanding.  Chances are I'm just as embarrassed to ask the question as the question is annoying to the receiver.

Now I will admit, I too get annoyed at some of the questions that get posted here, and other places.  My first thought is - check the shop manual - and then I thought... 

There was a gent who had an early SII and he was starting the process of fully restoring it - himself.  He was constantly asking very basic questions and finally started emailing me directly with basic questions.  I finally asked him "do you have an actual shop manual for your Rover" - he said "no".  All he had was the Haynes manual, a parts book and the internet.  I stressed the need to get the shop manuals as well as the optional equipment book - just incase - so he did.  A couple weeks later a got a huge thank you from him.  Now, whenever someone keeps asking basic questions, I ask if they have the shop manuals.  I'm surprised at how many don't, they think the Haynes manual and restoration guides and the internet are good enough.

Also - not all Land Rover shop manuals are created equally.  The first one I got was the one I was told would cover my Rover; it does, yet it's got more in commonality the late SIIa than the early one.  This created frustration as well and I'dhave to ask people about certainparts and clarification.  Eventually I was able to get a copy of the manual that covers the SII and the SIIa - there was definitely a difference.  Same goes for the parts books.

Not all of us are born mechanics, or pick up the skills easily, there are still parts of the manual I don't understand and have given up trying to understand.  And there are still parts I have no clue what they are called.

Just keep this in mind when someone asks those basic, annoying questions.
Logged
'63 SIIa 88 Station Wagon named Grover

Mpudi: So how did the land rover get up the tree?
Steyn: Do you know she has flowers on her panties?
Mpudi: So that'#039s how it got up the tree.

Genem

  • Moderator
  • Master of the oils
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Perthshire
  • Posts: 2293
  • Member no : 4186
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #50 on: September 15, 2021, 07:03:38 PM »

I find that 95% + of the time people are met with respect and given a huge amount of support, even when, as Correus suggests, the right long term answer might be "Why not buy a copy of the manual ? ".  My personal "limit" arrives when an individual repeatedly asks absolutely basic questions without making much if any attempt to follow the good advice they have previously been given across multiple threads.  In terms of access to the books, there is really no excuse, for paid up members they are available, 24/7 in the technical section of the website.

I make no claims for my mechanical skills, I've been described as a "ham-fisted gorilla" by a garage mechanic before now, I know my limits, I hope, some spanner work and basic electrics. I've limited welding experience and no machine-shop training or skills, nor do I have access to drills, presses or the like. I'm genuinely in awe of people who can competently make or refurbish their own parts. I recently had great help from a number of members, including the donation of a complete spare carb. when I was having problems, I've seen members bend over backwards to help others, literally go miles out of their way or "relay" parts across not only the UK but Europe too. Last year an overseas member contacted us about his son, broken down in deepest Wales - local members were contacted and all spoken to reacted instantly to try to assist. I think this is a fantastic Club, in that view I accept that among almost 2500 people there will be some whose attitudes and values are not mine, I'll muddle along with most, perhaps comment where I feel the need. That covers my views on the "general" side of the question, what sort of Club are, what is the atmosphere like. I'll conclude that bit with a couple of images of the library, for those who have not seen it before - Attached below.

Edited to remove references to a deleted post.

     
« Last Edit: September 15, 2021, 11:23:27 PM by Genem »
Logged

Worf

  • Moderator
  • Master of the oils
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Gwynedd, North Wales
  • Posts: 513
  • Member no : 3448
  • .:
    • Aberdaron B&B
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #51 on: September 15, 2021, 08:50:42 PM »

This thread appears to have gone way OT  :-\
Logged
"If tha knows nowt, say nowt an-appen nob'dee'll notice."

Correus

  • S2C Member
  • Master of the oils
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Belle Plaine, Kansas
  • Posts: 1043
  • Member no : 6508
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #52 on: September 15, 2021, 09:07:33 PM »

Odd, I find that 95% + of the time people are met with respect and given a huge amount of support, even when, as Correus suggests, the right long term answer might be "Why not buy a copy of the manual ? ".  My personal "limit" arrives when an individual repeatedly asks absolutely basic questions without making much if any attempt to follow the good advice they have previously been given across multiple threads.  In terms of access to the books, there is really no excuse, for paid up members they are available, 24/7 in the technical section of the website.

I make no claims for my mechanical skills, I've been described as a "ham-fisted gorilla" by a garage mechanic before now, I know my limits, I hope, some spanner work and basic electrics. I've limited welding experience and no machine-shop training or skills, nor do I have access to drills, presses or the like. I'm genuinely in awe of people who can competently make or refurbish their own parts. I recently had great help from a number of members, including the donation of a complete spare carb. when I was having problems, I've seen members bend over backwards to help others, literally go miles out of their way or "relay" parts across not only the UK but Europe too. Last year an overseas member contacted us about his son, broken down in deepest Wales - local members were contacted and all spoken to reacted instantly to try to assist. I think this is a fantastic Club, in that view I accept that among almost 2500 people there will be some whose attitudes and values are not mine, I'll muddle along with most, perhaps comment where I feel the need. That covers my views on the "general" side of the question, what sort of Club are, what is the atmosphere like. I'll conclude that bit with a couple of images of the library, for those who have not seen it before - Attached below.

Now, to the specific issue "Woodie 64" has alluded to. I read the thread and did not comment at the time but as it has resurfaced I will. Perhaps I got the wrong end of the stick but my reading of the thing was that the Club ( and guests, not all Forum posters are "Members") were asked if a given vehicle was of particular interest, having a low number etc. There were a number of responses but obviously not quite as fulsome in their praise as was hoped for. This was not a refusal to help, a brusque response to a beginner, it was an honest reflection of peoples views about the relative rarity of a nice vehicle. Somehow this has been translated into grumpiness with the wider Club. I am at a loss to understand quite why, frankly. I don't recall any of the responses as being in anyway unpleasant, other than not being quite the response desired. If I've misunderstood the situation then I'm sorry for that.

     

Where are those manuals located?  Are they here on the form or on the member website?  I've looked in the 'Technical Library' in the members section and only see service data and a maintenance chart.  I don't see them listed within the 'Worshop Wisdom' section either.
Logged

Genem

  • Moderator
  • Master of the oils
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Perthshire
  • Posts: 2293
  • Member no : 4186
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #53 on: September 15, 2021, 09:16:45 PM »

They are on the Website, available to members when logged in - so not avail;able to non-member guests.

The route is:

Go to the website, link via the box above.
Log in as a member - Alan (Wittsend) will sort you out if not already registered.
Hit the "Technical Library" tab, a drop down menu appears with "Workshop Manuals" at the top.
...and there they all are, ready to browse online or download your own copy.

G.

 

Logged

Correus

  • S2C Member
  • Master of the oils
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Belle Plaine, Kansas
  • Posts: 1043
  • Member no : 6508
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #54 on: September 15, 2021, 09:28:23 PM »

They are on the Website, available to members when logged in - so not avail;able to non-member guests.

The route is:

Go to the website, link via the box above.
Log in as a member - Alan (Wittsend) will sort you out if not already registered.
Hit the "Technical Library" tab, a drop down menu appears with "Workshop Manuals" at the top.
...and there they all are, ready to browse online or download your own copy.

G.

 

Okay...  tried that.  It immediately took me to the 'Maintenance Chart' with a link to the 'Service Data' area. 

While typing this, someone responded saying a drop down box appears when on a PC, but not on a mobile device.  Whoever they are, not sure what happened to the post, they are correct.  I just figured out, by accident, that if you are on a smartphone at least, that if you click AND hold, the drop down shows up.

I knew those, and other items, were available, just never found them.  When I think to look for them I'm usually on a mobile device.

Thanks!   
Logged

Genem

  • Moderator
  • Master of the oils
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Perthshire
  • Posts: 2293
  • Member no : 4186
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #55 on: September 15, 2021, 09:55:48 PM »

^^^^ One to flag up to Alan...

G.
Logged

Genem

  • Moderator
  • Master of the oils
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Perthshire
  • Posts: 2293
  • Member no : 4186
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #56 on: September 15, 2021, 09:59:15 PM »

Back on Membership Stats track, first job, the raw % of people who have joined and stayed with the Club.  That first 500 will have been with the Club for up to 35 years....

Next job will be to add a date range to those blocks of membership numbers - anyone fancy trawling the B2L back-numbers on the Website ?

As a starter, my number is 4186, dates to Feb 2012.  That allows us to say that a quarter of our members have been in the Club more than 10 years...
 
« Last Edit: September 16, 2021, 09:29:57 AM by Genem »
Logged

Tom

  • Moderator
  • Master of the oils
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Evesham, Worcestershire
  • Posts: 633
  • Member no : 3375
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #57 on: September 15, 2021, 09:59:33 PM »

Okay...  tried that.  It immediately took me to the 'Maintenance Chart' with a link to the 'Service Data' area. 

While typing this, someone responded saying a drop down box appears when on a PC, but not on a mobile device.  Whoever they are, not sure what happened to the post, they are correct.  I just figured out, by accident, that if you are on a smartphone at least, that if you click AND hold, the drop down shows up.

I knew those, and other items, were available, just never found them.  When I think to look for them I'm usually on a mobile device.

Thanks!

Hands up, that post was from me. I wrote it, and then went and tried it again and realised that on my iPad, the drop down box did appear and figured I must have been mistaken. I then deleted my post to avoid being misleading. Glad you got it sorted though  :cheers
Logged

Correus

  • S2C Member
  • Master of the oils
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Belle Plaine, Kansas
  • Posts: 1043
  • Member no : 6508
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #58 on: September 15, 2021, 10:05:19 PM »

Hands up, that post was from me. I wrote it, and then went and tried it again and realised that on my iPad, the drop down box did appear and figured I must have been mistaken. I then deleted my post to avoid being misleading. Glad you got it sorted though  :cheers

 :tiphat
Logged

Genem

  • Moderator
  • Master of the oils
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Location: Perthshire
  • Posts: 2293
  • Member no : 4186
  • .:
Re: Club Demographics
« Reply #59 on: September 15, 2021, 10:55:11 PM »

Now for location:

UK Regions to start.  Note totals will not add up, some members are listed in more than 1 UK Region

Anglia 156
Borders 124
Bristol 49
Central Shires 88
Cymru/Wales 75
East Mids 88
Essex 78
Kent 104
New Forest & Solent 172
N Wales & Shrops 110
North West 159
N. Ireland 13
Peak 140
Scotland N 63
Scotland S 53
Severn 183
South West 155
Surrey/Sussex 194
Thames Valley 154
West Mids 146
Yorks 163

Overseas Members:

USA 50
Canada 14
Chile 1
Iceland 1
Ireland 8
Portugal 3
Spain 1
France 13
Netherlands 35
Belgium 2
Germany 14
Denmark 3
Norway 7
Sweden 6
Switzerland 12
Austria 3
Slovenia 1
Italy 10
Greece 2
Malta 1
S Africa 2
Botswana 1
Kenya 1
Japan 1
Thailand 3
Australia 30
New Zealand 3
Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5   Go Up
 

Page created in 0.068 seconds with 19 queries.