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[Wittsend]

You need to be careful when comparing modern RON rated fuel with the old octane system or the later STAR system.
RON does not equate to octane or star 
This is why you shouldn't dice in and use the octane ratings when timing your vehicle today.
The manuals were written years ago and RON wasn't invented.

Modern fuel (sometimes called "petrol") is not what is was when Series 2s first appeared.
What's sold now is quite low in octane value, nearer to "pool" petrol of yesteryear.
.... and this is why we are having problems with the dilution of petrol with ethanol (ethyl alcohol).

The premium fuels are a little better.
You need to do some road tests and calculations to see if the premium fuels are better for your vehicle.

Regarding diesel, the premium diesels have a cetane booster (petrols equivalent of octane rating).
On a good run I notice a little more power (easier when running up gradients) and smoother running.
Whether the extra cost justifies using premium diesel all the time - I don't know.
You can use a diesel centaur booster additive like Miller's Sport Diesel.

I'm currently using this, bought from eBay.


A few mls per tankful, it goes a long way.
I also put the occasional squirts of a mineral 2-stroke oil in - using an old Redex UCL squirter that garages used to have.

Regarding the price of fuel:
The prices seem to change every day.
Nationally Asda have said they will be the cheapest when up against local competition.
This is confused by Sainsbury's and Tescos occasionally giving fuel discount vouchers away when you open over a certain amount.
You need your wits about you.

To that end I subscribe and use this online app Petrol Prices.com put it on your phone.
Very useful for when you are away from home.
 :petrol_pump



 

[Genem]

The E10 scam is operating here now. I went to refuel at the Texaco station I use because it's cheaper than the nearer to home Shell station and all the petrol pumps were for E10.  No super unleaded sold there. So it was back to the Shell station where I refuelled with V Power at the eye watering price of £1.499 per litre!!!!!! 99 octane petrol in an engine designed to run on 2 star. What a con.

I fail to see any "Con" here. Its your choice to put premium fuel in your vehicle. FBHVC recommend some very simple measures such as regular checks of fuel lines, which people should be doing anyway I'd have thought ? They suggest carburettor floats may discolour over time - whoopee do.  Performance issues ? They suggest a slight tweek towards a richer mixture and so on. As Alan suggests, its possible to add further chemistry, although I recall the laughter from my local garage proprietor, formerly engaged in engine testing for Rover, on seeing me with a bottle of "lead replacement" additive - which he described as "an utter waste of time, unless you plan on doing motorway speeds for tens of thousands of miles a year".  Keep Calm and carry on driving...   

[Wittsend]

Urm yes ... the lead replacement additives were of dubious and questionable value 

There's no evidence I know of that they did any good (well not for Land Rover engines) nor did they do any harm.

Octane and cetane additives are a different thing altogether.

Get your engine running nicely; static timing, valve and plug gaps set and then see if the premium fuels give you any benefit - then decide what to use.
Your engine will come to no harm if you use bog standard supermarket fuel.
Use new fuel lines and seals that are sold as compatible with E10 fuels.


 

[Daisythelandy]

Was out today and was using premium petrol for the last few weeks, found that the Landie could go up a long hill in fourth whereas previously I had to change down to keep the speed up to 40.... So the economy will be better too when not climbing hills. It runs well on good quality BP fuel , but not the supermarket cxxp that ASDA sell which has less additives.

Just saying.

Dave

[Wittsend]

You could try the ASDA fuel with an octane booster and see if performance matches that when using premium BP fuel.

If it does you can do sums to see which is best value.


 :petrol_pump

[Daisythelandy]

Thanks Alan, might try that but I still wouldn't use ASDA fuel, had a couple of bad fuel issues previously. The BP garage is nowwhere near ASDA but has normal petrol at 1.31-ltr which is only 1p more than ASDA.

Dave.

[mukagee]

Does anyone have a professional view as to whether we should switch to super unleaded after the introduction of E10 fuel, or whether an additive is necessary, and if so what additive. I have seen any amount of opinions but would appreciate a definitive response if there is a fuel guru out there.
Thank you
Mike

[Clifford Pope]

I've been trying to compare prices for Millers VSPe additive, which claims to prevent alcohol erosion (apart from giving an octane boost plus protection against valve seat erosion).
The choice seems to be between 250ml in an ordinary bottle, which is described as a one-shot additive treating 40l of fuel - ie you tip it in every fuel fill-up, at £14.49, which is pretty pricey.
Or, a special 500ml bottle that protects 10 tankfulls, at £28.99. At £2.90 a shot that on the other hand seems very cheap.

What's going on here? - it's hardly "bulk buying" to buy only twice the quantity, yet get something at a tenth the price.

The previous VSP additive, introduced at the time of the unleaded scare a few years ago, worked well in my experience. The Triumph I ran it in pinked on ordinary unleaded, yet was fine with the additive, and the valve seat erosion risk with unhardened seats appeared avoided.

So this stuff seems unlikely to be just snake oil, it's just the odd pricing that puzzles me.

[Davidss]

A couple of points.
Study of the contents list might prove informative; this might disclose the multishot version has a stronger concentration of one constituent. Alternatively the single shot version might show a dilutant, like 'non-aromatic kerosene'.

The other point is that people will pay extra for a simple to use single shot product. To them, removing the hassle of calculating how much to use at each tank fill is worth paying money for.

Several decades ago I was using a Cetane additive for use in a non Land Rover diesel engine.
As Mother was the main driver I distilled the additive into two small bottles, each doing half a tank.
If she was topping up the tank in advance of a long trip she could use one bottle. If filling the tank from a low level she tipped both bottles in.
I was happy to provide the bottle filling service, she found the dosing procedure simple to follow.

In a parallel example, some people will prefer to use a 'ready mixed' antifreeze, others, like me, will buy anti-freeze in a concentrated format and happily premix 5 litre containers to whatever value I prefer.

Regards.

[Alan Drover]

I don't need to use any unleaded additives as the 2.5 petrol engine has an unleaded head which was factory fitted.
It's the problems with E10  on fuel lines and carburettor components that concerns me.
I do a daily check on fuel lines.
 

[gilbo]

Does anyone have a professional view as to whether we should switch to super unleaded after the introduction of E10 fuel, or whether an additive is necessary, and if so what additive. I have seen any amount of opinions but would appreciate a definitive response if there is a fuel guru out there.
Thank you
Mike

Hi Mike
Sorry I am not a 'professional' (organic chemist that is!) but I posted my practical experiences of using E10 on a thread in July - you may already have read it. Anyway if it 'helps' here it is again.

Strange
I have driven all over mainland Europe and Scandinavia in my 2a over the last 10+ years, filling up with many tankfuls of E10 petrol.
So far, nothing has perished. Nothing has melted. I never noticed any difference in performance (in fact I considered the mpg to improve?). Oh, and it made no difference to how easily (or otherwise) it started!
Engine-wise - compressions are still spot on, valves clearly not burnt etc and it still pulls like a train!
So I do wonder if 'we' are getting a little carried away - especially if you are not considering doing many miles.
OK so there may be some 'chemical' issues but so far I have not seen any - anyway we have a choice. Spend more money and use non E10 fuel.
Maybe I was lucky. Maybe my rubber hoses are already of the correct spec (I don't know) and I run a Facet electric pump (for a number of reasons).
But, I agree - some more factual/practical information would be useful.

HTH

[oilstain]

I don't need to use any unleaded additives as the 2.5 petrol engine has an unleaded head which was factory fitted.
It's the problems with E10  on fuel lines and carburettor components that concerns me.
I do a daily check on fuel lines.

As he said^^^
I have a 2.5 petrol in a 86"
and my other 86" with the original 2.0 engine I fitted unleaded exhaust valves from the S1 club shop

[Genem]

It's the problems with E10  on fuel lines and carburettor components that concerns me.
I do a daily check on fuel lines.

I'm confused. Yesterday you posted about driving to another garage in order to fill up on BPs "V-power" premium fuel ?  Don't you have faith in that either ?

Personally I think there is a lot of over-blown hype going on here. These engines are not highly tuned formula one racing machines, they were built to be able to run on absolute grot, sold in cans by the roadside in the depths of the Empire. If I had a vintage Ferrari I might take some of this a bit more seriously...

[autorover1]

The fact fuel is marked as E5 or E10  does not actually help, as that indicates the maximum ethanol allowed in the mix. Both could have very little ethanal ,or the maximum allowed  .  If asked I am sure the staff at a filling station would not know the actual amount in any delivery.  In this situation I prefer to err on the safe side given the option and assume they are all worst case .

[Alan Drover]

The Texaco garage where I went first sold only premium petrol and all the pumps had E10 stickers so I went to the Shell garage where the V Power pump has an E5 sticker so I used that.
It's what E10 fuel does, or can do, to fuel lines, carburettors and fuel pumps that concerns me so until there's irrefutable evidence as what it does or doesn't do, I'll stick to super unleaded.
The lift pump on my Land Rover is a genuine Land Rover part Tdi one so I wonder what E10 would do to it as it's designed for diesel engines.