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[w3526602]

Hi,

The problems? Circa £200 Planning Application Fee, for about 12metres (40ft) of 2m high fencing, to give Barbara some accessible privacy in our SIDE garden (A 1m high fence would be PP exempt) and somewhere to play with her baby strawberries, etc. The lawned area of our garden is not wheel-chair, nor crutches, accessible.

I anticipate the fence will cost under £1,000, and resent the £200 Planning Fee.
I just "done a Google", and found this ...

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/401064-disability-and-free-planning-applications/

I hope that helps somebody here.

602

PS Disabllity Facilities Grants under £1,000 ore NOT means tested ... and you can keep coming back for more.

[Genem]

I'm not sure of the location vs the road/house but does this help ?

"Under permitted development your gate, wall or fence can be up to 2 metres in height, as long as: it's not facing a road it does not come any further forward than the 'principal elevation' (the front of your house) or the side elevation (the side of your house) it's not within or on the boundary of the grounds of a listed building"

G.

[Wittsend]

Corner plots are tricky.

A 2 meter hedge, no problem.

[Sheppy]

Normally planning fees for disabled works will only be exempt if the work proposed is solely the disabled person’s benefit ie bathroom adaptation, ramped access, parking bay. Not sure they would accept a fence being for disabled use.
D

[w3526602]

Corner plots are tricky.

Hi Alan,

Thanks for posting that picture. I can now download my camera, but still struggling to do things with the photos after that.

The malevolent thorn hedge has gone completely. You can see the existing 2m high fence on the rear garden boundary, but less obvious is that it turns thru 90*, with the last 1.5m linking the fence to the rear corner of the bungalow.  My plans are to extend the boundary fence as far as the front of the bungalow, (which will not obstruct traffic visibility).

Yeah, I guessed there might be "disabled use only" restrictions, but I don't see how they can enforce such a restriction ... it would be like giving PP for a bathroom extension that only Barbara may use. If I have to pay, I have to pay, but it's worth a token resistance.

A house not fifty yards away has a 2m fence right up to the footpath corner ... cyclists appear, riding on the footpath. with no intention of stopping. I once had a lady cyclist sitting on the front bumper of the Freelander, and many of my neighbours have had similar close encounters.

I have access to a tame Planning Consultant, from the Garden Law Forum, who enjoys a challenge.  I regard him as a cross between Sir Lancelot Spratt and the Lone Ranger. I will seek his advice and assistance.

A couple of months ago, I briefly discussed Barbara's situation with the "front desk" of a firm of Occupational Therapists (based in Crown Hill, Milton Keynes). Their fee for a visit/consultation is in excess of £600, but the lady mentioned that SSAFFA had recently picked up the tab for another client. My experience of SSAFFA has been two unanswered Emails, and two unanswered letters. Barbara's telephone enquiry was a waste of time.

We still have available, the RAF Benevolent Fund, the Civil Service Benevolent Fund, and we still subscribe to BENEDEN (Civil Service heath insurers).  WE don't need money, we need a friend with "Clout". Our MP has been "promoted" to Party Whip, which seems to mean that his presence is constantly required in Westminster. Barbara's case has recently been moved up to a NHS Senior Physio-therapist, who seemed aghast at the state Barbara is in. Just maybe?

My searches suggest that the only BENEFIT available to pensioners is Attendance Allowance, no matter how decrepit they are.

When we first requested assistance from the local Authority, the Social Worker demanded to see our bank statement. It only took her a few seconds to decide "You are not entitled!". She went on to suggest Equity Release.

"Onward and Upward!"

602

[w3526602]

Not sure they would accept a fence being for disabled use.

Hi Sheppy,

The Social Worker (Occupational Therapist) who first visited was surprised when I suggested that a Disabled Facilities Grant included access to the garden.

I referred her to the Disabled Law Society's Website. The subject was not raised again. I'd send you a paper copy, but it runs to about 40 pages.

I'm not asking for a grant for a fence, I just want not to have to pay for the planning application. Such an application will cost me a couple of hundred pounds. How much will it cost them to fight an appeal. Planning Applications have a set fee. Appeals are (or were) free for the Appellant. The LA would have to appoint a solicitor (£££) ... I can represent myself. I could abandon my appeal at any time.

I have considered just erecting a 2m high fence, without PP. If things go pear-shaped, I can just cut the top one metre off ... most of the expense will be in setting the posts in concrete. Then will be the time to plant a hedge of fruit trees on the boundary.

A normal hedge has thickness, and the plot is not wide enough to sacrifice the thickness of a hedge.

My daughter's estate, three miles away, built at around the same time, same LA, has planning permission for a car, van, or caravan in the front garden. My Grand-daughter has a 12ft mobile "den" in her mother's front garden. I have not seen my planning permission, so maybe I should invest a few quid. Time spent on reconnaisance is never wasted.

OT.  Disabled Facilities Grants include providing access to all family rooms. Our conservatory (18ft x 9ft) also acts as our laundry room, and is accessed from the kitchen. Yet again, Barbara is beaten by both conservatory doors having the lo-buck frames ... with a three inch high up-stand across their bottoms so the conservatory is a no-go area. A quick measure suggests the conservatory floor is only about 4" lower than the to of the upstand. So an aluminium ramp, with a 1:7 incline, would project only a smidgen beyond the front of the washing machine, and cost well under £1,000. Social Services will be pleased.    Don't blame me, I didn't write the rules.

602

[w3526602]

Hi Again,

See ... https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2008/1189/made

Unfortunately, tis covers ACCESS to a garden, so probably doesn't include fencing ... but it shows gardens are taken into consideration for DFGs.

This discussion is about Planning Fees, and Disabled related Privacy. Back to drawing board.

602

[Kernowcam]

I am doing a planning app at the moment. Just breathe and they want money, however I have often seen any disabled related work having no or a reduced fee.

[Sheppy]

Back to my original point 602,
To get a fee for an application, (not talking about a dfg here)wavered the works would have to be solely to benefit the disabled person.
What would likely happen if you did the works without an application is they would threaten to prosecution but given the costs and the fact local authorities have no money they would not pursue it. They would then put the contravention on the land registry, this would get flagged at the point the property come up for sale.
Shep(building control officer)

[w3526602]

Hi Sheppy,

Thanks for your opinion.

When I lived in the Swansea Valley, I could just wander into "County Hall", and have a chat with the Head Planning Officer.  Similarly the Swansea Land Registry. I once pulled the Head of the Council Planning Committee out of his bath, to witness that I was on my way to County Hall (after hours) to deliver a letter that had to be delivered "that day" ... Both signatures required, and Barbara was in the Midlands that week. The Planning Officer phoned my mate on Monday, to find out what was going on.

I lived in a residential area. Heavy mare and foal living in the coal cellar, several goats in the old wash-house. Two pigs in the Victorian pig sty, Chickens and ducks in the old Anderson shelter, including a Maran cockeral that crowed at a 02.30 every morning. On "Farrier Day", I would bring another four horses and two donkeys down from my fields (7.5 acres). I never had a single complaint, in fact everybody begged us to stay when I said we were moving.  I miss it.

My GP was ex-Royal Navy, with language to match. If he got an inkling that you were ill, he'd be knocking on your door. When one of his partners wandered into the waiting room, all the old biddies would study her swelling belly. (She wasn't married). Swansea Valley? Wonderful place to live?
 
Milton Keynes is much too "Controlled".

602

PS. One day the Swansea Canal burst its banks ... water up to window sill level in Pontardawe High Street.  Police helicopter spent 20 minutes hovering over the local car crim's  house (Council estate). A mate listened in, on his illegal radio, to a police helicopter crashing into a house roof.  Does anybody remember the miners trapped in a flooded mine, a few years back? It was just across the valley from my house.  Frequently woken by roaring engines and flashing blue lights in the lane outside my house. Never a dull moment. Police had to shoot a dog gone crazy, about 50 yards from my house, circa 3AM.  Stage coaches frequently arrived, covered in arrows.

[w3526602]

Hi,

Just an update ... I found this link ... posting it here so it can't get lost.

https://themighty.com/2018/04/disability-and-the-right-to-privacy/

(The SENIOR Physio-therapist told Barbara that she could "keep her knickers on" while demonstrating her ability to drop (literally) onto the WC. My comment about needing a high-level WC bowl was ignored. (I believe the porcelain bit is available four inches (?) taller than normal ... but would I be allowed to use it?)

Hmmm! I'm probably guilty of the above, too. My excuse is that if people don't know you have a problem, they won't/can't help ... which probably helps the Bean Counters.

My plan is to make our bungalow "all singing, all dancing disabled friendly" using a mixture of our own and public funds. When we pop our clogs, I would hope that somebody similar will buy our bungalow, rather than buy an unadapted bungalow (as we did) ... then have to wait up to 12 months for a Disabled Facilities Grant to be approved. In the long term, that will save Social Services money ... again and again.

To date, we have spent £1,000 converting the lounge/diner door into four feet wide French windows, so that Barbara did not have to zig-zag her buggy across the hall, to get into the bathroom.

Social Services provided a aluminium tread-plate ramp, so that Barbara could exit via the front door. Google suggests that it cost a lot less than £500, fitted. It had a 1:7 incline (legal?), and at the highest point, there was potential for a 12" fall, with no hand rails (legal?).

Er ... I regret to say that I (presumably able-bodied) had no option but to use this disabled aid. Discuss!

In the event, and with my walking abilities reduced to virtually a shuffle, I felt somewhat vunerable using this plank bridge.

We called in our builder, who removed the complete 5ft wide uPVC door assembly, moved it out three inches, then dropped it three inches down the front of the step, and "nailed" it back, thus "burying" of the 3" upstand.

He then raised the brick-paved (permeable) drive to match the height of the bottom of the door, with gentle slopes both across, and down the drive. Barbara's electric buggy doesn't notice the miniscule "step".

Barbara has just paid that bill ... £8,000, but that included similar brick pathing across the full width of the front garden, making parking space to park two large cars, thus avoiding the "car shuffle" depicted in every episode of the TV series "Butterflies" (Wendy Craig). I wonder if Google could find that scene, for the education of our younger readers?

Barbara is unable to access our conservatory, via the kitchen door ... same up-stand followed by a step-down. The washing machine and tumble drier are in the conservatory. This is a mandatory grant problem (Access to Public Rooms) according to the Disabled Facilities Grant Legislation web-site.  Nor can she exit to the rear garden, via the conservatory (and only) back door ... same three inch upstand immediately followed by an eight inch step.

I can feel a "Crusade" coming over me.

602

[w3526602]

OT.  Disabled Facilities Grants include providing access to all family rooms

Hi,

The Disabled Law Society Website (link given previously) specifically mentions that a grant for new central heating system will cover the boiler, but not radiators in rooms not occupied by the disabled person.

Completely OT ... looking at our water rates, and the cost per cubic foot of water, makes me wonder what savings could be made by installing a scatter can gentleman's urinal. When we were planning to build a bathroom extension, our builder was not at all phased by the suggestion.

£5.000 for a flat roof, or £15,000 for a pitched roof blending into both bungalow and garage roofs.

602

[w3526602]

Hi Sheppy

I keep coming across the rule that disabled facilities, financed by a Disabled Grant, may not be used by anyone other than the disabled person.

I suggest that such a restriction is ULTRA VIRES because it is UNREASONABLE.

Social Services provided a ramp to enable Barbara to enter and exit the front door (She is still unable to use the back door, nor access the lawn) As the ramp was provided by public funds, the above rule would prohibit me from using my front door.  Do you agree?

The only rule that I'm aware of, that might apply, is that any grant must be repaid, if we move house, or die, within the following ten years.

Alan was kind enough to post pictures of the aluminium ramp, and the raised drive that quickly replaced it (at our expense). Did the presence of that ramp prohibit me from using the front door??

It would be interesting to see how the LA would/could prevent me "using" a fence? I suppose they could fine me for leaning on it?

602

[Wittsend]

The restriction(s) is unenforceable !

Think about it - how are they going to tell if an able-bodied person uses them

They would have to appoint a permanent "live-in" guard 

 

[GMF]

A bit of a conundrum. A thought - Garden "features" do not require planning upto 8ft and as far as I am aware this includes the front as well (I stand to be corrected if any one has any more info) - if you put up a 6ft trellis on the inside of the fence, say a foot in, this is a garden feature as it is not forming the boundary and then grow some climbers or espailliers up it. We often do this with blocking views into gardens for customers when they want a bit of privacy.