S2C Forum Archives
Main Section => Welcome to our virtual Pub Meeting ... => Topic started by: rivarama on July 01, 2021, 05:29:45 PM
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Hi All,
As some of you know, I bought a second Land Rover series as I intend to keep it at my holiday home in France.
Unfortunately, the whole export process to Europe as become a mine field.
As one would expect the French administration is unreachable and unhelpful !!
From what I can tell from Google searches, in addition to all the documents needed, I would also be liable for VAT (20%) and duty (10%)… which makes the whole thing quite expensive.
I am wondering whether anyone has ever gone through that process and could provide some guidance or know of a French LR owners club I could contact to ask those questions.
Thank you
Paul
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try
http://landelles2020.fr/
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have you joined "les temps des series" ?
Lots of info on their forum (mostly in french of course) and they have a facebook group
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.... and we have quite a few forum members based in France. I'm sure they'll offer some advice when they see this topic.
:cheers
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This process is a bit of a nightmare… I called the French customs and the administration in charge of issuing titles (French equivalent to V5)… none of them could give me a straight answer. I also called them later to double check and asked the same questions and got different answers ! Joy!!
I will keep digging and will revert back with more details, as it might help other owners who might want to bring their cars to Europe in the future.
What is clear is that I will need a certificate of conformity from Land Rover France.
I am hoping that given that the vehicle was manufactured when the UK was still part of Europe, and it’s over 25 y/o, I won’t have to make modifications to comply with the European regulations.
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there are so many series owners in France who have gone through this
Parksy, on here, for one
As, mentioned earlier, le temps des series is the french series land rover forum. They will know
They also know how to run tdi and modified series in France - but I don't think it is as kosher as it should be, so don't ask them that !!
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Good luck with the French bureaucracy - a friend moved to France earlier this year and is trying to get his Uk purchased Citroen registered over there. His forehead is getting very bruised hitting it against countless obstacles.
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Have things changed with regard to importing into France since BREXIT
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Good luck with the French bureaucracy - a friend moved to France earlier this year and is trying to get his Uk purchased Citroen registered over there. His forehead is getting very bruised hitting it against countless obstacles.
Would you mind PM’ing me his contact details so we can compare notes and find a way forward?
Thank you
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I managed to register mine last year , takes a while but not that difficult i will dig out the paperwork and let you know whats needed , you will need to know if you want ordinary registration or classic car registration slight difference in whats required ..
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Hi All,
As some of you know, I bought a second Land Rover series as I intend to keep it at my holiday home in France.
Unfortunately, the whole export process to Europe as become a mine field.
As one would expect the French administration is unreachable and unhelpful !!
From what I can tell from Google searches, in addition to all the documents needed, I would also be liable for VAT (20%) and duty (10%)… which makes the whole thing quite expensive.
I am wondering whether anyone has ever gone through that process and could provide some guidance or know of a French LR owners club I could contact to ask those questions.
Thank you
Paul
Hi Paul,
what do you mean by exporting to Europe? Does that means you simply can't travel to your holiday home and let the car there registered in the UK?
As it will stay definitely in France it has to be registered in France? For me there is no reason to pay VAT, it's your car, you drive it to France so no VAT to pay.
It's true french administration is a nightmare but your registration process should be easy, what you need to provide is:
- a tittle of property: the V5 at your name or the previous V5 + purchase proof (car bill of sale...)
- registration inquiry document Cerfa 13750*05
- home proof
- driving licence copy
- insurance document copy
- conformity certificate (for a car model sold in France, otherwise you have to go through the FFVE for a 101 for example)
- customs clearance document 846 A
- french MOT younger than 6 months
- that's all
Good luck,
Marc
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I managed to register mine last year , takes a while but not that difficult i will dig out the paperwork and let you know whats needed , you will need to know if you want ordinary registration or classic car registration slight difference in whats required ..
Thank you !
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Hi Paul,
what do you mean by exporting to Europe? Does that means you simply can't travel to your holiday home and let the car there registered in the UK?
As it will stay definitely in France it has to be registered in France? For me there is no reason to pay VAT, it's your car, you drive it to France so no VAT to pay.
It's true french administration is a nightmare but your registration process should be easy, what you need to provide is:
- a tittle of property: the V5 at your name or the previous V5 + purchase proof (car bill of sale...)
- registration inquiry document Cerfa 13750*05
- home proof
- driving licence copy
- insurance document copy
- conformity certificate (for a car model sold in France, otherwise you have to go through the FFVE for a 101 for example)
- customs clearance document 846 A
- french MOT younger than 6 months
- that's all
Good luck,
Marc
Hi Marc,
Although I can drive the car to France and leave it there on UK plates, my UK insurance wouldn’t cover me after 6months, and no French insurance would cover me for more than 3 months on UK plate, as a temporary insurance until the car gets a French title. So effectively, I would need to drive my car back to the UK every 9 months.
Not really the kind of rides I would like to undertake as the car will be left in the south of France.
As for the VAT, I would still have to pay 5.5% (instead of 20% as the car is over 25 y/o).
From speaking with the French customs, it seems that they need a certificate of conformity in order to clearing the vehicle and issuing the 846a form. Is that your understanding?
Thank you
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Hi Rivarama (beautiful boat, by the way!),
I can’t help with the details because I haven’t completed the process yet and I also started it before the UK left the EU…
I didn’t need a certificate of conformity for the payment of duties (dédouanement). For me, this was a pure « financial » action.
I guess the 5.5% are the duties payable, refuced because it is an older vehicle.
My understanding is that the 20% VAT will still need to be paid on the total sum. ( in fact, this is what happens with parcels from the UK - a tough one because we still have to pay UK VAT as well 😄)
I’m going through the registration process with the FFVE (Fédération Française des Vehicules d’Epoque) because it’s more or les impossible to get a certificate of conformity from Land Rover France for old vehicules. I have to say - this is what I was told, I didn’t try!
The FFVE used to be a soft touch and all sorts of wierd and wonderful things got through. They seem to be a lot more careful now - I’ve just done my 109 which was a relatively simple case of a lost logbook - it took over three months of to and fro.
So, sorry, no real details but I’ll help in anyway I can if you need it.
Cheers, Tony
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This is how i did it , i used https://www.cartegrise-cafe.com they do all the administration work but first you will need all the necessary paperwork a visit to local centre des finances publques for a certificate D'acquistion (quitus fiscal) for that you'll need V5 and a reciept for car a hand written one will do , if your english m.o.t is more than six months that wii be accepted if less then a control technic is required . For the letter of conformity email [email protected] that took about a month to arrive and around 200 euro's . You will need proof of address and copy of passport , that will get you normal registration if you want (voiture de collection) then contact FFVE on five.org for a certificate d'immatriculation vehicle de collection for that you'll need photos of car front back inside and one with the engine number that took about three weeks to arrive and around 60 euro's the cartegris cafe was around 220 euro's then there was the tax same as road tax but you only pay that once i paid around 150 euro's depends what engine you have , once you have all paperwork as i said i used cartegrise cafe but you can find others that do as well . once i dropped off all paperwork it was around five weeks to get registration .. Good luck.
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Hi.
Controle Tecnhique (French MOT) ? I thought the French had a similar MOT Age Exemption to UK (I could be wrong, it's been a few years since we sold our "Ruin in France. Small profit).
I believe you will need a km/hour speedo, but I assume that a bi-lingual S3 speedo will suffice. ????
French trailers have their own registration plates. Memory is vague about VED, insurance and testing.
RH Dip headlamps? I pondered on having both radiator and wing mounted headlamps, with a change over switch, so I could choose which side of the road I wanted to drive on. My experience was that the truckers hurrying South from the ferry in the wee hours did not like centre headlamps, and would hit you with their array of roof mounted "night suns". I have no idea how many HGVs they can squeeze onto a ferry, but it's "lots", and none of them are friendly.
I also pondered on fitting a pair of "Lotus 7 replica", head lamps, with right dipping facility, in front of the wings, in addition to the rad mounted lamps, and a change-over switch. As all fitted lamps must work, it may have been necessary to fit the temporarilly "unwanted" lamps with hoods.
I believe that any vehicle spending more than 180 days, in a year, in France, must comply with French Laws. Headlamp masks will not comply with Controle Technique requirements.
Alternatively, I think that you could fit a pair of plastic head lamp bowls (Vehicle Auto Electric Supplies), and carry a pair of LH or RH dip reflectors, and quickly swap them over at the ferry or rail terminals. The French do not like sealed beams ... possibly because of the requirement to carry a full set of bulbs.
OT ... due to the difficulties of changing a blown side-lamp bulb on a modern car, I have read that Monsieur Plod will tell you to call out a garage ... and send the bill to the French manufacturer. I never had cause to test that.
We found it quicker, and cheaper, to drive from our place at "Le Deluge" (think Evran/Dinan), to Calais, and catch the train, than to catch a ferry from St Malo. Set off just before midnight, empty roads almost all the way (apart from the convoy of truckers heading South). Lovely! Arrive at the Terminal, book the dogs in, and have a cup of coffee before boarding the train. The only fly in the ointment was the M25 toll in the morning rush hour.
On one daytime return to UK, I stopped to water our two GSDs, leaving Barbara in our "hippy-ish" van conversion. I returned to find her being interrogated by two strapping (one of each gender) Customs officers, each carrying a huge side-arm, and riding big motorcycles. We had difficulty explaining why we hadn't taken the St.Malo ferry. Eight hours on a ferry eventually becomes boring ... unless you can afford to travel in style, or as part of a group.
We eventually sold our now habitable "ruin" at a small profit. An enjoyable experience, but ....... living for a couple of months at a time, in a remote hamlet, where nobody spoke English (though Barbara has A-level French ... and passed A-level Welsh at O-level) had lost it's charm.
A French girl with a Series 2 (bought in UK) lived in the next village. And we got on well with a neighbour who drove a Renault 4 (jelly mould, pre-Dauphine). A local supermarket had a corner dedicated to English tastes, including Marmite. We listened to BBC Radio Jersey. A local restarant was run by a retired Jersey bank manager ... she introduced me to moules, which I enjoyed, but I wouldn't want to eat them in public again.
602
Ruin? we had to install water, electricity, and a fosse septique, which meant living in a 12ft caravan, with two German Shepherds, a chemical toilet, and a petrol generator, buy bottled water. I swapped the Land Rover and caravan batteries over every day ... one running the Land Rover, the other providing, lights, chemical toilet flush, and entertaiment.
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602---- no age related controle technique here , ordinary cars every two years after there four years old , voiture de collection every five years.. :tiphat
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We live in a fast moving world.
Rules and regulations change all the time, you/we need to keep up with what's current.
Brexit no doubt has throw a spanner in the works.
I might be wrong, but when I last looked into it - you couldn't register a RHD vehicle in Spain, whilst you can in Portugal.
I seems (to me) that each country has their own set of rules). For instance I could emigrate to Italy and take up residence on Mrs Wittsend Irish passport, Whereas in Spain my GB passport makes residency harder.
To reiterate:
If exporting a classic vehicle to France (or any other European country) you need to meet the current regs, which is why you are asking for help.
:RHD
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I don't know how plentiful series 2/2a land rovers are in France, but it may be easier to buy a vehicle already registered there. Its another option to consider.
All the best Gary
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This is how i did it , i used https://www.cartegrise-cafe.com they do all the administration work but first you will need all the necessary paperwork a visit to local centre des finances publques for a certificate D'acquistion (quitus fiscal) for that you'll need V5 and a reciept for car a hand written one will do , if your english m.o.t is more than six months that wii be accepted if less then a control technic is required . For the letter of conformity email [email protected] that took about a month to arrive and around 200 euro's . You will need proof of address and copy of passport , that will get you normal registration if you want (voiture de collection) then contact FFVE on five.org for a certificate d'immatriculation vehicle de collection for that you'll need photos of car front back inside and one with the engine number that took about three weeks to arrive and around 60 euro's the cartegris cafe was around 220 euro's then there was the tax same as road tax but you only pay that once i paid around 150 euro's depends what engine you have , once you have all paperwork as i said i used cartegrise cafe but you can find others that do as well . once i dropped off all paperwork it was around five weeks to get registration .. Good luck.
Amazing !! Thank you so much !
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Hi.
Controle Tecnhique (French MOT) ? I thought the French had a similar MOT Age Exemption to UK (I could be wrong, it's been a few years since we sold our "Ruin in France. Small profit).
I believe you will need a km/hour speedo, but I assume that a bi-lingual S3 speedo will suffice. ????
French trailers have their own registration plates. Memory is vague about VED, insurance and testing.
RH Dip headlamps? I pondered on having both radiator and wing mounted headlamps, with a change over switch, so I could choose which side of the road I wanted to drive on. My experience was that the truckers hurrying South from the ferry in the wee hours did not like centre headlamps, and would hit you with their array of roof mounted "night suns". I have no idea how many HGVs they can squeeze onto a ferry, but it's "lots", and none of them are friendly.
I also pondered on fitting a pair of "Lotus 7 replica", head lamps, with right dipping facility, in front of the wings, in addition to the rad mounted lamps, and a change-over switch. As all fitted lamps must work, it may have been necessary to fit the temporarilly "unwanted" lamps with hoods.
I believe that any vehicle spending more than 180 days, in a year, in France, must comply with French Laws. Headlamp masks will not comply with Controle Technique requirements.
Alternatively, I think that you could fit a pair of plastic head lamp bowls (Vehicle Auto Electric Supplies), and carry a pair of LH or RH dip reflectors, and quickly swap them over at the ferry or rail terminals. The French do not like sealed beams ... possibly because of the requirement to carry a full set of bulbs.
OT ... due to the difficulties of changing a blown side-lamp bulb on a modern car, I have read that Monsieur Plod will tell you to call out a garage ... and send the bill to the French manufacturer. I never had cause to test that.
We found it quicker, and cheaper, to drive from our place at "Le Deluge" (think Evran/Dinan), to Calais, and catch the train, than to catch a ferry from St Malo. Set off just before midnight, empty roads almost all the way (apart from the convoy of truckers heading South). Lovely! Arrive at the Terminal, book the dogs in, and have a cup of coffee before boarding the train. The only fly in the ointment was the M25 toll in the morning rush hour.
On one daytime return to UK, I stopped to water our two GSDs, leaving Barbara in our "hippy-ish" van conversion. I returned to find her being interrogated by two strapping (one of each gender) Customs officers, each carrying a huge side-arm, and riding big motorcycles. We had difficulty explaining why we hadn't taken the St.Malo ferry. Eight hours on a ferry eventually becomes boring ... unless you can afford to travel in style, or as part of a group.
We eventually sold our now habitable "ruin" at a small profit. An enjoyable experience, but ....... living for a couple of months at a time, in a remote hamlet, where nobody spoke English (though Barbara has A-level French ... and passed A-level Welsh at O-level) had lost it's charm.
A French girl with a Series 2 (bought in UK) lived in the next village. And we got on well with a neighbour who drove a Renault 4 (jelly mould, pre-Dauphine). A local supermarket had a corner dedicated to English tastes, including Marmite. We listened to BBC Radio Jersey. A local restarant was run by a retired Jersey bank manager ... she introduced me to moules, which I enjoyed, but I wouldn't want to eat them in public again.
602
Ruin? we had to install water, electricity, and a fosse septique, which meant living in a 12ft caravan, with two German Shepherds, a chemical toilet, and a petrol generator, buy bottled water. I swapped the Land Rover and caravan batteries over every day ... one running the Land Rover, the other providing, lights, chemical toilet flush, and entertaiment.
I spoke to my local FFVE chapter and no modifications will be required (gauges, lights etc..) if I register the car through them as a classic.
The “control technique” will only be needed every 5years.
Only vehicles registered pre 1/1/1960 are exempt on control technique.