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[oilstain]

Sorry to start a new topic but just found this-
https://www.eurocarparts.com/p/wynn-s-e10-protector-250ml-555770474?utm_source=bm23&utm_medium=email&utm_term=Image+-+DOW&utm_content=Thu+30th+Sept+-+END+OF+MONTH+SALE+-+USE+CODE:+SALE60+-+STREETWIZE+STEERING+WHEEL+LOCK&utm_campaign=Thu+30th+Sept+-+END+OF+MONTH+SALE+-+USE+CODE:+SALE60+-+STREETWIZE+STEERING+WHEEL+LOCK&_bta_tid=30603120421401966146164608806142131176790067158086998370920203351897331863699713811085559181234668991121930

so will it be safe to run older engines on e10 if you add this

Wynn's E10 Protector 250ml

    Use one 50 ml shot with every full tank
    Makes E10 safe for petrol engines
    Protects the fuel system against the harmful effects of E10
    Reduces the risk of expensive engine damage caused by E10
    Lubricates the entire fuel system, including seals and gaskets

[oilstain]

also just seen this-
auction: #154602153521

sorry if these have been posted before but I did not see them and having some older petrol engines.....

[Genem]

If people are worried I suppose its a simple bit of maths, once the current fuel supply issues settle down. The Wynns product is roughly 1ml per litre, so is the price difference at the pump greater than about 5p per litre between E5 and E10, assuming 5 tank-fills at 45 litres ?  Repeat the sum for the Lucas product when the dose rate is known. Subtract the faff factor for having to remember to buy the stuff and tip it in the tank.

The other option is to "fuel-proof" the vehicle, cost out replacement fuel lines etc vs £12 a bottle. 

The other question is just how damaging is an extra % of ethanol in the system. The cynic in me suspects the additive manufacturers have a vested interest in hyping up the issue. Even this apparently pro E10 article shows images of metal left in water for months to illustrate "corrosion" - few of us, I'd suggest, fill our tanks with water... at least not deliberately !

https://classicenginesmodernfuel.org.uk/E10/Default.aspx?DYN_MENU_MainMenu=1000001

[Daisythelandy]

Hi, Frost's are selling this stuff and they say it's endorsed by the 'Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs (FBHVC)'

https://www.frost.co.uk/ethomix-corrosion-inhibitor-additive-ethanol-protection/

The bottles all look the same on Fleabay just with different labels on but.... is it the same stuff?

Dave

[oilstain]

If people are worried I suppose its a simple bit of maths, once the current fuel supply issues settle down. The Wynns product is roughly 1ml per litre, so is the price difference at the pump greater than about 5p per litre between E5 and E10 ?  Repeat the sum for the Lucas product when the dose rate is known. Subtract the faff factor for having to remember to buy the stuff and tip in in the tank.

The other option is to "fuel-proof" the vehicle, cost out replacement fuel lines etc vs £12 a bottle.

I would prefer just to buy E5 fuel and not bother with adding stuff but I have found some garages no longer sell E5 and a bottle of this stuff may be handy to keep in the Land Rover

[Craig T]

What exactly are we expecting to fail on our Land Rovers with this fuel?

I have the original nylon fuel lines, a rubber diaphragm in the fuel pump, a rubber O-ring in the Zenith carb and the economy valve in the carb which is probably made of rubber too.

If the O-ring fails I'll change it to a Viton one and if the two diaphragms fail, I guess I have no choice but to replace them with new ones.

Everything else I can think of in the system is metal so I can't really see what harm E10 fuel can do to my Land Rover?

Hard to see how a small additive can work either, it won't remove the ethanol as it's already there, can't eat it away as the tank of fuel would then lose 10% of it's contents.

Craig.

[oilstain]

Whilst you have listed most things^^^^^ I dont want to doing many of these at the roadside in the rain and also read on another post about soldered joints failing

[Genem]

I tend to agree with Craig, that there is little to worry about. If actually concerned then by far the best option would be to replace the fuel lines etc with modern materials now for a few £ and a day in the shed, rather than be spending an extra 5p a litre ad infinitum ?  I'm not sure that 50-60 year old rubber is that clever in a fuel system anyway ? 

[Bradley66]

What exactly are we expecting to fail on our Land Rovers with this fuel?

I have the original nylon fuel lines, a rubber diaphragm in the fuel pump, a rubber O-ring in the Zenith carb and the economy valve in the carb which is probably made of rubber too.

If the O-ring fails I'll change it to a Viton one and if the two diaphragms fail, I guess I have no choice but to replace them with new ones.

Everything else I can think of in the system is metal so I can't really see what harm E10 fuel can do to my Land Rover?

Hard to see how a small additive can work either, it won't remove the ethanol as it's already there, can't eat it away as the tank of fuel would then lose 10% of it's contents.

Craig.

Electrolytic corrosion could potentially be a problem between some of the bits in the fuel system , rust formation in the fuel tank if you don't use the Land Rover regularly and have a regular throughput of fresh fuel.
Make sure the hoses are up to spec and the other bits are , as you state Viton , then the problems should be relatively minor.
Volatility in hot conditions will still be an issue and there is the possibility that cold starting and icing up of the carb may be more of an issue.

Having said all of that my 2.25 is running fine on E10.

[LN11AAB498A]

There's also this from CLASSIC VALVEMASTER™ PLUS.

https://classicvalvemaster.co.uk/products

Their impressive claim:

Endorsed by the FBHVC, Valvemaster™ Plus with a unique phosphorus formulation was shown to offer the highest level of protection of all products tested.

Valvemaster Plus can be used with 95, 97, 98, 99 or higher octane rated petrol containing E5 or E10 ethanol.

The best protection after lead against valve seat recession

Increases fuel economy by up to 2%

Protects your engine under all driving conditions

Keeps fuel systems clean

Protects against corrosion

Increases acceleration by up to 3%

Not suitable for catalytic converters

[Genem]

^^^^ I suspect "up to" is doing some heavy lifting there
 

[oilstain]

I think the real test will be in 12 months time for those who are using E10 on a regular basis that have had or not had any problems

[Phil2014]

After reading a post about e5 being harder to get, did a quick search for e10 and found this, in answer to the last post, nearly 2 years on, regularly use e10, not had any problems.

[Alan Drover]

After reading a post about e5 being harder to get, did a quick search for e10 and found this, in answer to the last post, nearly 2 years on, regularly use e10, not had any problems.

I'm concerned with irregular use therefore E5 for me. I have to use E5 in my Stihl petrol garden machinery as they told me to do. Utterly ridiculous as proper Land Rover petrol engines were designed to run on any *&%^$ petrol.
When 2 star was abolished I wrote to Land Rover asking how I should retime the engine to run on 4 star and their reply was they couldn't give any details because they said they didn't forecast the demise of 2 star. Eventually after the 2.5 petrol engine was fitted with a rebuilt Zenith and distributor I timed it by ear.